Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane, WonderfulLife v Clockwork CLOSED

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Which Best Picture-nominated drama do you prefer?

Poll ended at Thu Sep 24, 2009 4:06 pm

Citizen Kane (1941, Orson Welles)
2
2%
Citizen Kane (1941, Orson Welles)
2
2%
Citizen Kane (1941, Orson Welles)
2
2%
Citizen Kane (1941, Orson Welles)
2
2%
It's a Wonderful Life (1946, Frank Capra)
11
11%
It's a Wonderful Life (1946, Frank Capra)
11
11%
It's a Wonderful Life (1946, Frank Capra)
11
11%
It's a Wonderful Life (1946, Frank Capra)
11
11%
A Clockwork Orange (1971, Stanley Kubrick)
12
12%
A Clockwork Orange (1971, Stanley Kubrick)
12
12%
A Clockwork Orange (1971, Stanley Kubrick)
12
12%
A Clockwork Orange (1971, Stanley Kubrick)
12
12%
 
Total votes : 100

Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane, WonderfulLife v Clockwork CLOSED

Postby Luhks on Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:06 pm

Ultimate Movie Cup, Oscar Snub Bracket, Round Two
Matchup Four: Citizen Kane vs. It’s a Wonderful Life vs. A Clockwork Orange

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(Note: Citizen Kane and It's a Wonderful Life tied in Round One. Pick one.)

Citizen Kane (1941)
Directed by: Orson Welles
Written by: Herman J. Mankiewicz and Orson Welles
Starring: Orson Welles, Joseph Cotton, Dorothy Comingore
Academy Awards: 1 win, Best Original Screenplay; 8 nominations, Best Picture, Director, Actor, Film Editing, Cinematography, Original Score, Sound, Art Direction
Best Picture from 1941: How Green Was My Valley from John Ford
IMDB Ranking: #29; TSPDT Ranking: #1; AFI Ranking: #1

It’s A Wonderful Life (1946)
Directed by: Frank Capra
Written by: Frances Goodrich, Albert Hackett, and Frank Capra
Starring: James Stewart, Donna Reed, Lionel Barrymore
Academy Awards: 5 nominations, Best Picture, Director, Actor, Film Editing, Sound
Best Picture from 1946: The Best Years of Our Lives from William Wyler
IMDB Ranking: #32; TSPDT Ranking: #45; AFI Ranking: #20

A Clockwork Orange (1971)
Directed by: Stanley Kubrick
Written by: Anthony Burgess (novel) and Stanley Kubrick
Starring: Malcom McDowell, Patrick Magee, Michael Bates
Academy Awards: 4 nominations, Best Picture, Director, Adapted Screenplay, Film Editing
Best Picture from 1971: The French Connection from William Friedkin
IMDB Ranking: #53; TSPDT Ranking: #93; AFI Ranking: #70

Which Best Picture-nominated drama do you prefer?
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby PandaVamp on Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:10 pm

For me, A Clockwork Orange most definitely.
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby DarkUFO on Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:24 pm

It's a Wonderful Life
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby Iceman on Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:57 pm

It's a Wonderful Life :D
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby zeek on Tue Sep 22, 2009 5:42 pm

I went for It's a Wonderful Life too :thumbup:
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby Finli Otego on Tue Sep 22, 2009 6:21 pm

A Clockwork Orange
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby DharmaFlashes08 on Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:40 pm

Aww, It's a Wonderful Life

What's that quote? "Every time a bell rings, an angel gets its wings." It's adorable every time that little girl says it. :wub:
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby Joshua on Tue Sep 22, 2009 9:05 pm

Clockwork Orange :thumbsup:
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby Brookie on Tue Sep 22, 2009 10:28 pm

It's a Wonderful Life :thumbup:
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby HelloBrian on Wed Sep 23, 2009 12:56 am

Clockwork Orange
But I feel kind of bad voting because I never saw Citizen Kane.(I saw It's a wonderfull life though. :bored: )
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby Luhks on Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:17 am

I don't understand these results at all. My vote goes to It's a Wonderful Life. I would vote for Kane well ahead of Clockwork.

I'm not too fond of A Clockwork Orange, not because I object to violent content, but mainly because most of the movie is an extraordinary bore.

I also somewhat object to the film's treatment of the free-will theme, with its suggestion that what the state did to Alex was worse than what Alex did to his victims. I just flat-out disagree. The necessary product of choice is consequence. If you choose to rape and murder, you take away the free will of others, and you have no right to complain about losing your own free will.
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby Finli Otego on Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:21 am

I've said it before, but it's very hard for me to play favorites like this. These films are SO different from each other. I vote based on instinct: Of the choices given, what would I put on and watch right now? I'm in a "Clockwork" mood.
I guess that's part of the fun of doing these Cups. Forcing yourself to choose.
I also somewhat object to the film's treatment of the free-will theme, with its suggestion that what the state did to Alex was worse than what Alex did to his victims. It's quite simply not true.

It is an uncomfortable subject, and the way it's presented is even more uncomfortable. But what I love about the story is that it brings it up in the first place. I never saw it as taking one side or the other, just simply showing you these awful things and letting you form your own opinion about it. Maybe I missed something.
The necessary product of choice is consequence. If you choose to rape and murder, you take away the free will of others, and you have no right to complain about losing your own free will.

I totally agree with this, but it didn't seem to be what the film was trying to support or deny to me. What I think the film (and especially the book) was trying to get across was that you can't force someone to change. You can't fit someone into a socially-acceptable box if they don't participate. They have to want to change.
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby GummieWorm on Wed Sep 23, 2009 3:49 am

I totally agree with this, but it didn't seem to be what the film was trying to support or deny to me. What I think the film (and especially the book) was trying to get accross was that you can't force someone to change. You can't fit someone into a socially-acceptable box if they don't participate. They have to want to change.


This is absolutely true. It's what the title A Clockwork Orange actually means. One of my favorite quotes from the book illustrates the meaning behind the title: "The attempt to impose upon man, a creature of growth and capable of sweetness, to ooze juicily at the last round the bearded lips of God, to attempt to impose, I say, laws and conditions appropriate to a mechanical creation, against this I raise my sword-pen."
The original version of the book also includes a final chapter in which Alex ends up changing on his own, growing up, wanting a "regular life", etc. This also isn't in the movie. Read the book; it might give you a new appreciation for the movie. :D
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby Luhks on Wed Sep 23, 2009 4:16 am

Here is a link to an interview from Kubrick, in which he addresses the same topics I mentioned.

http://www.visual-memory.co.uk/amk/doc/interview.aco.html

I think the film does not achieve its aim. Certainly, there must be limits to the power of society. Certainly, the use of such methods would not be justified under most conditions. BUT, to me, Alex is the rare exception. He exists in the part of the spectrum in which such methods would indeed be justified. The price you pay for free will is responsibility. Society did not make Alex the way he was. He chose to act. He brought brutality upon himself. They still treated Alex more humanely than he deserved to be treated.

It's almost the equivalent of the following: you set out to make a documentary that raises awareness about animal cruelty, and you started by finding the most vicious, feral dog imaginable; you took footage of the dog attacking adults children and the elderly; and then you watched someone put the dog to sleep. (In other words, you want to challenge the extent to which the ends justify the means, so you show an example in which the ends clearly do justify the means. Logically, it's a non-sequitur.) At a certain point, people have the right to defend themselves. One's freedom to swing his fist only extends as far as the next person's face.


As I said, though, my main complaints about the film stem from the fact that the majority of it is boring. You could achieve the same impact, generate the same discussion, with about half as much screen time.

Citizen Kane and It's a Wonderful Life are much better movies.
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Re: Movie Cup, Round Two: Kane vs. Wonderful Life vs. Clockwork

Postby mom on Wed Sep 23, 2009 5:02 am

It's a wonderful life :wub:
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